Tuesday, February 8, 2011

BBC Radio2 Folk Awards 2011

At the BBC Radio2 Folk Awards Jeremy Vine said this:
"Folk is musical journalism."

DISCUSS in less than 2000 words.
 
Donovan won the Lifetime Achievement Award ...
 
 
Who said, "Old Hippies never die?"

18 comments:

London Apprentice and Special Bitter said...

Oh gosh poor Donovan! My how we have ALL aged. I remember his distinctive guitar strum style. He was a big part of the colourful scene and wrote some good stuff. I think he was credited with teaching his finger-picking to John Lennon when they were in India trying to relax using that transcendental meditation with the Maharishi.
Of course I tried all that but whenever I stopped so did the money! That was one trick they all seemed to master. Is it too late now to tell me how that's done?

parkingspaceman said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
parkingspaceman said...

"Folk [music] is musical journalism" - given the state of journalism today, this statement is extremely insulting to folk music. Thank wotsisname that there's no money in folk music, or Rupert* Murdoch would control most of that, too. (*not Richard, as in the deleted post: I think I must've been listening to too many old radio comedy shows - as my jokes will surely attest).

Dogsbody, Scrivener and Wretch said...

Perhaps if we were to rephrase this hypothesis in the past tense, "Folk [music] WAS ...," then it would have some veracity.
You know: broadsides and all that.

Folklorists have sweated for decades trying to elucidate the historical provenance of characters who populate lyrics in the folksong canon.
Did Geordie really poach the King's deer?
Just who was Willie o' Winsbury?
Was there truly a massacre on the Braes of Yarrow?
Precisely who was that outlandish knight?
Do the answers actually 'blow in the wind'?

In centuries to come, I predict that those who come after us will question the very existence of PSM and DBS&W.
Ph.D.s will be awarded for such research. Academic tomes will be published and celebrated. OBEs will be gained.

So, please continue, PSM, we've still got over 1000 words to go!

parkingspaceman said...

As many people know, folk music is not one thing, it is several. Reportage? yes. Expression of the human condition? yes. Myth and fable? yes. Social comment? yes... .
I am ignorant of the reasons for giving Donovan Leitch a Lifetime Achievement Award. Has he done anything in folk since "Catch the Wind"? Anyone who will write and record anything as banal as "Hey, gyp, dig the slowness" has clear quality judgement problems. I think he must be a Mason.

BTW: you missed the greatest conundrum: were John Bowlin and 'Steeleye' Span real people? (And the second greatest: is Dogsbody, Scrivener and Wretch a pseudonym or a description?).

Dogsbody, Scrivener and Wretch said...

I tend to concur with some of the above observations.
Journalism is, or should be, reportage and social comment.
It often expresses the human condition.
Occasionally it is myth and fable. After all, just what did Bill Clinton do with Monica?
(Sorry, that's simply gossip.)

Mr. Vine, in his metaphor, did not say "Folk [music] is musical journalism – [and nothing more.]"
We all know it's a whole lot more, and in these terms, it is not an insult to folk.
Most importantly, folk music and songs live and survive in the hearts, minds and voices of those who perform it.
That’s in contrast to commercially printed newspapers – bought today, burned tomorrow.

Now, I agree that Donovan’s life-time achievement is open to question, but for some of us he was there as part of what was perceived as a folk-revival.

Who's John Bowlin?
Actually it's Tom Bowling, who was the elder brother of Charles Dibdin. Dibdin wrote the song in memory of Thomas who died at sea.

Of course Steeleye Span are real people. They just keep changing the line-up.

DBS&W? I leave it to those who come after to address that question.

parkingspaceman said...

I sense deliberate obtuseness, here, but anyway (as ever, I stand to be corrected): John Bowlin (sic, or possibly Bowling), a farm foreman, is supposed to have had an altercation with John 'Steeleye' Span, a waggoner under Bowlin. Span made a song about it, known as Horkstow Grange, set to the tune used for "Andrew Rose". One George Gouldthorpe remembered his father singing it, and sang it to Percy Grainger in 1906 or 08, I believe. Attempts to verify Span's and Bowlin's existence have failed. "Tom Bowling" was written by Charles Dibdin (b Southampton 1740 d London 1814), after the death of his elder brother Thomas, a sea captain, at sea. Tom Bowling is fictional - that is factual. John Bowlin and Steeleye Span have not been verified as real, but might have been.

Dogsbody, Scrivener and Wretch said...

If I knew what being deliberately obtuse was, I'd try harder.
I am prepared to believe every word regarding foreman John and waggoner Span.
I confess I have been educated by PSM's post.
Who would dare to correct such an erudite commentator?
Now, come on PSM, we've only occupied 693 words ... I know, I have counted them all.

parkingspaceman said...

Who said, "Old Hippies never die?"
Well, ignoring the dreadful punctuation (tut-tut), I can't find out, but George Wilson & Bill McKinnon (as 'Nine Mile Ride') sing a song with that title - it's by Ron Trueman-Border. (In answer to the question, someone said "They just go to pot").

Dogsbody, Scrivener and Wretch said...

Who responded, "They just go to pot"?
Such spontaneous wit has the worthy hallmark of PSM.

parkingspaceman said...

The 'pot' comment came up in an internet search. I have no way of judging its 'spontaneity' or otherwise. Someone might have spent days working on it, honing it, polishing it. Thanks for the compliment, though.

London Apprentice and Special Bitter said...

Veracity - Folk - journal - money - music - Rupert - joke - comedy - Folklorists - canon - provenance - knight - PSM - DBS&W - tomes - reportage - BTW - gyp - concur - obtuseness - Monica - 1740 - erudite - pot - honing.
The above represents a sample of your speeling eerrers and Miss Used words or those I do not utter let alone comprendez. How would I cope were I was to join your Fluke Club? What frienda have I that would understand the gloom of your deep intellect? Do you do any Cee songs? That is songs of the Cee in the deep keys of Cee the minor and Major Cee? What rhythmical embellishments do you permit among those who frequently frequent?

parkingspaceman said...

I scarcely know where to begin.
1) assuming that LA&SB's comments have serious intent, I apologise for mis-use and poor spelling, (I can't verify 'honing', but 'honeing' seems wrong), wherever it has occurred. However, I can but wonder whether something he has ingested hasn't warped his linguistic faculties.
2) assuming that LA&SB's comments are meant as a 'joke': I am in dire need of deep and thorough explanation.
3) he could, simply, be off his chump, and raving.

Dogsbody, Scrivener and Wretch said...

FROM THE OFFICE OF THE VICE-CHANCELLOR OF THE REGNUM UNIVERSITY OF WHYKE

I am instructed to declare that the word-count for this academic exercise has now been exceeded.

While the VC expresses his grateful admiration of those individuals who have contributed to this discussion, further comment will be superfluous to the final academic achievement.

All are hereby awarded honorary diplomas in tangential thinking, arboriculture, verbosity and inter-personal near-abuse(Dip.TTAV&IPNA.)

DBS&W was dismissed from the Vice-Chancellor's presence with a single word: "ENOUGH!"

parkingspaceman said...

"Arboriculture"?????

Dogsbody, Scrivener and Wretch said...

Think of a sentence containing the words 'wood' and 'trees'.

parkingspaceman said...

Blimey! One asks for elucidation, and all one gets is insults to one's intelligence and ramblings from a fictitious academic!
I know what arboriculture is: I can't see the relevance to what's gone before. Not 'seeing the wood for the trees' is, I feel, DS&W's speciality - perhaps he could take a degree in it - at the Balls Pond Road University of Whyke (is it the Otter University of Chichester? the Verulamium University of St. Albans? Did you mean 'Regis'?). Yours, Confused (of the Groves of Academe Higher Institute of Accredited Learning), Donnington).

Dogsbody, Scrivener and Wretch said...

The aforementioned Vice Chancellor has instructed me to repeat the following word for universal consumption:
ENOUGH!